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Author Topic: SEMOW Lawn Racers  (Read 3169 times)
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Rocky1
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« on: October 14, 2007, 12:22:28 PM »

Well since we need something here and we haven't reviewed it yet...

SEMOW Lawn Racers
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Jurgen
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« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2007, 01:27:44 PM »

Looking nice bud.... I like the green on black colors... It shows your handwriting so.... How much did you actually do? And how much is it "pork chops" work? 

 clap Boogie
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« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2007, 02:12:33 PM »

Nice clean, crisp looking site.  I read the text on the front page and found it informative, and am wondering how it does SEO wise........ although there may not be alot of competition in this area, the page read well, and certainly didn't appear that SEO was a major focus on what was said (this comment is positive, not negative.... atleast intended that way)
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Rocky1
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« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2007, 02:44:40 PM »

Keith was working on black background last I saw, so I ran with that. It's the same Dreamweaver template I used on CanUBall so I copied the stylesheet there and made a few changes. After setting it up, he indicated he had thought about the black and green concept but couldn't get it to work like he wanted it too.

Site work itself, I did most of it... Set up the template, layed out the pages, and navigation, got the tables working like we wanted them, etc. etc. Had a few problems with the template on Keith's end initially for some reason, Dreamweaver wanted to save everything he was doing as a template... I crashed it on my end at one point trying to make a few changes, and since it was easier that trying to fix it, I simply downloaded the last revisions to recover it. Everything worked great there, so I had him do the same on his end, and all was well thereafter too. Simply had to get everyone on the same page I think!

Gave him a few pointers on little goodies like the image rollover effects in Member Pages, and got him in there working on a few of those, and a few other odds and ends in design along the way. He jumped in in numerous places and helped with filling in the data in the tables and so forth, once I got the format layed out. Club President offered his input along the way, as far as the way a few things were arranged and looking, so we made him happy too.

Pointed Keith at JAlbum and turned him loose, he figured out set-up there and he did most of the albums. In fact he did all of the member albums, and most of the albums on the Photo page. Because of our file structure we had to edit the back button from thumbnails page on all of the albums, told him what was happening there once we found it, and told him how to fix it, and he did get everything corrected after that. Where we set all albums in an Albums folder on the server, we were backing out only to the Albums folder with the default link on the button set at ../  in JAlbum, and we had to take it back to the member's page or back to the Photo page. Wasn't a biggy, just a little annoyance, didn't catch it until we had most of them created, or we could have changed it in JAlbum.

Graphics work is mine, we wanted something eye grabbing for announcements, but I didn't want obnoxious, so I threw the blinking gif file together. It's enough to get noticed without being intrusive. Business cards were all on the old site, but most were simply black and white, many looked almost like copied letterheads in fact, took those apart, saving and enhancing the art, and the original look and feel in the event they are company logos, and then recreated most of them in cleaner copy. Header... I wanted big, bold, and clean, they loved it but wanted the club logo mower on there. Keith tossed together a few files and sent them for my review, and I thought it added to the header nicely, but was a little flat in appearance, so I Bevel and Embossed it, to give it a 3D look. Green all the way across the top didn't look right, it was overwhelming, and considering different monitor resolutions, the fade to black works, because the image runs out and background takes over. Looks nicer and it works well in all resolutions. 

I got their forum started and appointed Keith to Admin, and he filled in all the Topics on the board. About the only thing I did there was get the board up and going on the server. Have to create the english-utf8 folder over there now too. Have the same issues on that one with no "new" button.

We were trying to work it on the backside of the old material, but we kept having problems with files going to the main folder rather than the test folder, since we both set up for future use in FTP, and when I got to the first album it made for more headaches than it was worth trying to direct the links in JAlbum! We weren't quite ready to go live, but I told him it was being more of a pain in the ass than it was worth at that point, that we'd go live with it and push it through. To tell everyone it would all be up in a few days.

He got threatened by one female member who was NOT impressed with the image I used on her profile! Had to change that one quick to prevent bodily harm on his part! And, a rival racing club found it, and inquired how he did several things therein. Being the politician he is, he simply told them it was a trade secret! rofl

Overall... Keith contributed quite a bit!! And, he learned a lot along the way. He's ordered books on Dreamweaver and PhotoShop to further enhance his abilities also. I think he'll do well in managing it, we just needed to get it up and running for him; the learning curve there was a wee bit steep. From what I've heard, the club really likes it and considering their accomplishments, they are deserving of it! Was fun building it for them, and I've been invited to join them at their annual banquet next month, which I most certainly do intend doing so!
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Rocky1
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« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2007, 02:47:54 PM »

Nice clean, crisp looking site.  I read the text on the front page and found it informative, and am wondering how it does SEO wise........ although there may not be alot of competition in this area, the page read well, and certainly didn't appear that SEO was a major focus on what was said (this comment is positive, not negative.... atleast intended that way)

Haven't really worked it too hard yet Ken, that was the original copy on the About page, but I felt it was more appropriate on the Index page. Just looking it over it isn't too bad for SEO, so I'm going to give it a little time for the search engines to redirect, build a few links, and see how it shakes out, before working it over too hard. I think it will fair reasonably well, they aren't too worried about running with the major players, more concerned about being found in Missouri for Lawn Mower Racing, and it'll definitely do that.

We'll see how it works first, and go from there!
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Jurgen
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« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2007, 02:59:24 PM »

Good job and good job on Keith.... Hey Keith, you have to stay here with us and help others with their questions.... You can do it.....
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clicken
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« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2007, 07:54:46 PM »

There needs to be a correction in the following…

Q.) What do I get for my donation as a Private Citizen?
A.) You will a sign as well but "In Memory of" or "Salute To" or something of your choice.

hint... Add the word 'get'.

Also, my eyes are really messed up now. The white text on the black is just too much and I had to leave before going through all of the pages. Couldn’t black text be on a light background and then centered in that black content area?

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Rocky1
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« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2007, 12:37:31 AM »

Thanks Clicken! Fixed!!

Well...

1.) It ain't white #ffffff, it is #fffddd, kind of a beige color actually to cut the glare.
2.) I just design them... they call the colors... Keith went that direction before indicating that was what he wanted, he's the one that's got to work on it, so I gave him what he wanted.
3.) I'm gettin really tired of building black websites honestly, next guy that suggests they want a black website, I'm going to jump over the table, grab him around the throat and choke his ass half to death!
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kenwvs
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« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2007, 12:57:40 AM »

and I like the black......... it looks so sharp........ but could be hard on the eyes if spending alot of time there
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Rocky1
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« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2007, 01:58:43 AM »

Black sites are very difficult to work with, it's hard to find colors that work well on black. And, no matter where you go, someone will tell you... "You really should do that black text on a lighter background." I gurantee it! Build a black site, and take it on the road, I don't care how many forums you go to, someone will attack your black site, for no other reason than it's black.

Either that or because she errr, I mean, they... used to have a black site too, and people yelled at her err, I mean them... until uhmm, oh the hell with it... she changed it, and she now wanders aimlessly through the forum world reciting the chant of the white site Zombies!  lol2

I love ya Clicken, don't worry, I don't ever take offense at suggestions to that effect! Boogie
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clicken
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« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2007, 06:15:37 AM »

Thanks Rocky, I tried to say it as nice as I could and I’m not just repeating what I have heard as others might do but how I felt after trying to read through it.

Notice I didn’t suggest that black not be used but suggested a way of making it work with just a little extra effort and thought.

The navigation works with the green text but only because the background isn’t a pure black. The dark gray helps to keep the text from glaring… something of the same needs to be applied to the content area... but it doesn't have to effect the whole content area, just behind the text.
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cssaddict
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« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2007, 06:39:24 AM »

I'm working on a color change for someone right now, and their color choice is black. However, as much as I don't like it, this does look pretty good. It is a site with a ton of photos on it. And I actually like how it looks.
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Rocky1
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« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2007, 07:02:25 AM »

Notice I didn’t suggest that black not be used but suggested a way of making it work with just a little extra effort and thought.

The navigation works with the green text but only because the background isn’t a pure black. The dark gray helps to keep the text from glaring… something of the same needs to be applied to the content area... but it doesn't have to effect the whole content area, just behind the text.

 eyebrow But then it's not a black site... It's a dark gray site with a black border around part of it!!
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clicken
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« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2007, 09:38:24 PM »

Okay Rocky,

It is tables because I didn't want to spend your time helping me with CSS hahaha!

I couldn't get the links or the header but you can use your imagination.

http://www.schoolhouseflash.com/WIP/SEMOW.htm

AND don't worry about hurting my feelings if it isn't going to be used because I wanted to see if I could put image behind my words! It was a good experience for me!

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Rocky1
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« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2007, 01:25:41 AM »

 biggrin

It looks cool Clicken, but...

1.) It ain't a black site like that!  dunno

2.) You'd have been shit out of luck on my time helping you with CSS layout! I mighta got it to work in IE, but Jurgen usually gets an e-mail when I'm working on CSS layout!  rolleyes2

3.) You misspelled Lawn in the header dear!  bigsmile

4.) I always use Justified alignment, unless it creates a problem with words running waaaay far apart. Then I will either change the setting in CSS for that specific div, class, or ID; or in-line format a particular item if the issue is restricted to only one or two spots in copy.

Newspaper and magazine have been around a whole lot longer than websites, and there is a reason they use justified alignment! It's not because it spaces the words further apart making them easier to read either, it's because it leaves a consistent trailing edge on the right side of the paragraph making it easier to follow the content to the next line, thus making it easier to read. 

5.) Whaddya mean you couldn't download the header image?!  eyebrow

Code:
<body>
<div id="masthead">

<!-- This is the banner in the header -->
  <div align="left" id="Layer1"></div>
  <img src="Assets/SEMOW_placeholder.gif" width="20" height="80"></div>
 
  <!--- Image is called from #Layer 1 in the rightNav style sheet --->    <------It tells you where to find it right there!!
   
<div align="right" id="Layer1"></div>
<a name="top"></a>
  </div>
<!-- end masthead -->

You have to open the stylesheet to find the link to the image! You can't just right click on it!

Code:
background-image: url(Assets/SEMOW_header.jpg);


6.) Your copy proves what I suspected with your initial comments on the white glaring at you. I think your monitor is quite a bit brighter than mine, which some just naturally are, while others offer a considerably darker resolution Clicken. I don't have an issue with the white glaring on my monitor, honestly. Wherein the page you offered there, is a tad dark on my monitor, making that rendition more difficult for me to read than the off-white on black. Brightness and contrast are auto-set to mid-range on my monitor, in that manner I don't overcompensate one way or another. And, I do check the work on 3 different computers here with different monitors to make sure I'm not straying too far in any direction, from middle of the road.

The monitor I used to have at work, your rendition would not be legible at all without highlighting the text, there isn't enough contrast in it. I learned that one the hard way! You have to be very careful in not providing enough contrast, there are a great many dark monitors out there in the world.

7.)  I do know where you're coming from, from a design perspective, but... racers are a different breed. They like black, no... let's rephrase that... they love black! It goes back to the color psychology thing. Black is menacing, black is intimidating, black is Dale Earnhardt's colors, and that's all the excuse they need. If you do a search for racing sites, and run through as many of them as I have, you'll find there is more black websites amongst racers than anything else. Also, if you look at a race car, it's typically all about making it look gawdy, 2 - 3 highly contrasting colors, decals pasted all over it, big numbers, lettering everywhere, lots of chrome. Put one on the track without that appearance, and it doesn't look right. Therefore, I often design racing websites in that fashion, because that is what racers want.

Were I going to design it in the manner you suggest, it'd look more like this - http://www.ndlmra.com/

Two colors, no boxes, no tables, high contrast black text over a light background. Subtle horizontal rules, justified alignment, borders on pictures... single line, because it isn't as gawdy surrounding a picture in a simple high contrast layout, where a single line suffices in placing the picture on the page... IMHO.

Why wasn't that one designed to look gawdy or intimidating, like a race car, as suggested above? Because I designed it to sell races to potential host venues, and many, if not most of them don't understand that philosophy in racing either. And, furthermore... I don't want to initimdate anyone there, so black wasn't considered an option!!  stickdance

And, the reason I placed the image top of the content next to the first paragraph on the SEMOW site, is... I'm not using the big black margin around my background that you are, and that makes my content div considerably wider, as in about 20% of the page or 204 pixels wider, wherein the first paragraph becomes 1 long line with only 1 or 2 words wrapped, making it look out of place at the top of the page. The picture was placed next to the first 2 paragraphs, because they ARE much shorter than the third, thus forcing them to wrap more frequently, and in such, lending more depth to those short paragraphs, and making them seem to contain more content than they really do!  biggrin

And, I didn't write said content, haven't SEOed it, haven't made but one or two changes of any nature to it in fact, and those were correction of grammatical and spelling errors only. Thus, I didn't have any control over length of that content, aside from trying to make it look like much more than what it was on the page, so I stuck a picture beside it!  goodjob

 flowers
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